I have issue with having some sort of DRM. Pirates will always find a way around it.
I also have an issue with splitting profits with TDC. I think DeadmanDines was the only person to give an example with percentages, and it was 50%. I think 50% is a bit excessive for a do-nothing third party.
Isn't there also something in the standard licenses that you're not allowed to sell klik games without Clickteam's permission?
I have issue with having some sort of DRM. Pirates will always find a way around it.
The idea of DRM (for me anyway) is to stop Joe Bloggs just sending it to his mates. Pirates will always crack your DRM. It's a balance between having just enough to stop the average user and not having too much to annoy honest Joe Bloggs.
I also have an issue with splitting profits with TDC. I think DeadmanDines was the only person to give an example with percentages, and it was 50%. I think 50% is a bit excessive for a do-nothing third party.
I think you've totally missed the point of this thread.
Isn't there also something in the standard licenses that you're not allowed to sell klik games without Clickteam's permission?
In the standard version there is. In the Dev version there isn't. In the standard version you need to add in a CT logo or something.
The entire idea of selling higher quality games on TDC would be to get people to help donate to TDC while getting something in return. I'm sure that when we submit our games, it would still be an option whether we wanted to even have it check out as a potential selling game, regardless of the quality of the game. Plus, I don't believe $5 or $10 is excessive. If anyone is going to pull out their credit or debit card to buy anything online, anything under $15 is usually not going to be subject to much discrimination. The trick is getting people who actually want to pull out their credit or debit card, or getting kids under 18 to convince their parents to let them.
Rather than buying games though, I'm sure we'd both shut some people up and help TDC out a bit by creating something of a credit system where you buy points. The points currency would be accurate though in that you wouldn't have to buy a lot more points than you intend to spend on a single game. If you want a game that's 10 points, you can buy a point package of 10 points. This also gives TDC a way to bring in more immediate money for when people buy points but don't use them right away. When people go and spend points on games, than you have a system that calculates the dollar value of half of the points spent on the game, and adds it to their account. If at the end of the month, they make over a specific amount of money, they can have it sent to them. This way we can have a minimum balance of how much money someone makes before TDC is obligated to handing it out. This also helps TDC keep funds in their hands to run the site.
Also, you're allowed to sell games made in MMF 1.5 Standard and MMF2 Standard. You just need to include Clickteams logo as part of the agreement. No permission or royalties needed.
Yes, that's all. You have the logo in the game. People who make commercial-level games will be aware of this already.
EDIT: I really like your idea Brandon, the credits and then payback later. But if it's not automated to send the money immediately to the creators, that's a lot of moolah going through TDC's hands and could potentially lead to some messes. (though admittedly nothing big) Particularly if bills are paid but someone didn't get paid correctly beforehand. Are the head admins comfortable with that? Site coding hiccups are all ok when nobody's money is on the line...
I'm sure many of you have run across this before but I think any Rev. Anthony at Destructoid does a good job of inspiring those of us who hope their is commercial viability for small indie games.
I think it is a good idea. Thus the one who said 50% that is really too much. 5-25% percent is more likely for the site. But then the site should consider making legal and things stuff to make this work. Basicly making a way to pay off the creator -s. And that seems unlikely to me, since there are a lot of other sites who sell games like popcap and alike who are more popular and were made exactly for that purpose. But i am all go for this idea. Since the market of small games is increasing.
And for those who are saying about that their games will be cracked and that is problem its really idiotic to say that, i mean blizzard games get cracked probably the soonest than any other, as with most good games. So if your game is cracked that probably means its good. There are always people that doesnt have the means or the money to buy games, or wish to test games before they buy them.
If you have standard version of mmf2 you only need clickteam logo in intro screen. You can read it in mmf2 help - runtime agreement. And you can sell it.
And for those who are saying about that their games will be cracked and that is problem its really idiotic to say that, i mean blizzard games get cracked probably the soonest than any other, as with most good games. So if your game is cracked that probably means its good. There are always people that doesnt have the means or the money to buy games, or wish to test games before they buy them.
I'm saying that DRM, in general, is just retarded. There is no system that is perfect. The best DRM platform I've seen is on Steam and XBLA. All you have to do is be online to play the game (or in the case of XBLA games, be playing on the Xbox that purchased the game.) Everything else? Either DRM bad enough where it doesn't stop pirates at all but still punishes the people who bought the game, delays pirates until they can circumvent the system but still punishes the people who legitimately bought the game, or completely fucks the end user's system (as with SuckROM that EA is so keen on using).
So let's say that Klik games do use the Steam style of DRM, where you just have to be online to validate your copy of the game. Is such a system really worth investing the time and money into developing an authentication server? Will the profits of the game (or the money from the developers pocket) offset the cost of maintaining a server (bandwidth included)?
There's more to DRM than just stopping people from redistributing your game. I think it's stupid to incorporate DRM on such small games, for more reasons than I gave. (I'm writing a more lengthy post, and DRM is one of the topics I cover. I also go into more detail about the three points I mentioned in my previous post.)
I do think the admins would need to come up with a portfolio of ideas and then talk to an accountant about the legal implications, since they would become a kind of business. So it's all good fun. But yeah, the suggestion of 50% was just for illustrative purposes, I dunno what they would try charging really.
The best bet in my opinion is having users whom have commercial titles be offered the chance to give their ref feral code information, just like Steve mentioned, We do it at Gamesare with BMTmicro and it has bee proven effective...
Submission of games proceeds as normal, if a submitter has a commercial title and provides TDC with their affiliate codes, then not only do they get the game posted, but it could also be posted with a buy link, and better positioning on the site. They get something and TDC makes a bit of money, and this method does not require a ton of revamping and fits well into the current system
DRM is a waste of time. Only about 10% of people pirate anyways, and DRM just annoys people. It only works for about a week until pirates can hack it anyway. Spore became the most pirated game of 2008 just because of its annoying DRM.
Just sell the Klik games and media and then you'll be fine. I really like the Idea. I mean, TDC + Clickteam already gives the author lots of coverage and this will make even more coverage. And if ads generate money based on the amount of people who see them, then more people will see them and generate more money. It's win-win.
And **** it, people are willing to pay $10-$15 dollars for computer games that are **** so why not awesome Klik games? They don't even need to be good to be bought!
If someone is selling their came with BMT Micro, the author can still sell the game as they please on their own but the TDC can post a affiliate link on the its. If the game is bought on the tdc some profit goes to both the author and the site, something to look into for sure.
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EDIT: I just watched the video and I agree with that guy. I only wish I had a job, then I would donate money.
I couldn't edit as replies were already made.
This is such a tough topic to comment on and i honestly cannot (yet) see a way out of this, though most people have already offered some in-depth ideas that could work. I'll keep thinking...
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Edited by OMC
